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If I’m in public, and a child under ten is being obnoxious, that is absolutely the parents’ responsibility. Notice I didn’t say it was your fault. There is NO FAULT at this point. I, the childless adult, do not judge you for how your kid acts, although I understand your confusion since this seems, from the outside, to be the way you judge each other. I judge you for whether or not you handle it.
I do this, not because I ‘m selfish, as the childed righteous would like to say. I’m about as selfish as you, and I have as much moral sensibility as you.
If I were merely behaving selfishly I would yell at the girl who’s just learning her job at the checkout. She is just as annoying to my selfish kingdom as the screaming child, but she’s doing the best she can. So I cut her a break. You know, in my deluded, I’m-the-center-of-the-universe way. But the child is your responsibility, and HE DOES NOT KNOW ANY BETTER.
And if you just let him crawl over my table at dinner, or scream for minutes on end at the store because you’re busy and don’t want to handle him, that’s on YOU. And it’s rude.
That is why this letter is to you, obnoxious parent. Your child is precious. If you don’t teach her how to act, it’s you that’s the monster.
I can’t believe you didn’t know that.
Before everyone starts telling me I’m selfish, I’ll just say it: I’m selfish. But unlike many, I realized that before I conceived. Some who realized how selfish they were after the baby was born let their kids crawl over restaurant tables to the detriment of my dining enjoyment. Not to mention the smaller matters of civil discourse and the child’s future ability to function socially.
I don’t know if I can handle the responsibility of having children, and parents who let their children act like animals in public are doing nothing to change my mind. I seriously wonder how they can be so blind.
As for the rest of you, who love your children enough to teach them how to behave properly, which I’m sure is 100% of blog readers — I don’t know how you do it. Kudos, and again. You are the shit.
We’re not worthy.
29 responses so far ↓
1 youdontknowmyname // Dec 31, 2007 at 10:28 pm
heck yea. nd nobody knos y.
im never havin kidz until im married to someone who is less selfish than myself lolz
2 mandy // Dec 31, 2007 at 10:45 pm
this is why my child is hardly taken anywhere!!
although, I wonder if it has the BAD effect of not letting him learn how to act in public???
in anycase, in the house he stays unless he is at school or at a park or in the mcdonalds playland, etc!!!
3 Graham Wegner // Jan 1, 2008 at 12:15 am
Hmmmm…. part of me agrees with your POV but another part tells me that you can’t judge every scenario like that. There are other reasons a child is acting up (or appears to be) and the parent’s way of dealing with it (by intention) is to ignore what looks like a tantrum to the onlooker. There are kids who have to deal with all sorts of sensory and socialisation disabilities that portray similar (but not the same to the practised eye - take it from someone who knows!!) behaviours to the spoilt brat who just wants their own way.
And their kids will never develop any sort of coping skills if their parents don’t get then out and about with Mr. Joe and Ms. Jo Public. Sometimes enacting “discipline” can escalate things like anxiety for these kids and actually add fuel to the fire, rather than resolving the problem.
Just a thought from another viewpoint…
Graham Wegner’s last blog post..When Letting Go Is The Problem
4 GingerTPLC // Jan 1, 2008 at 12:20 pm
I can see Graham’s point about “diminishing by ignoring” but dang it. There’s a point where intervention is necessary for the comfort of others!
BTW–I don’t consider myself childless but rather, child-free!
Important distinction to hubby and me, who’ve been happily child-free for over 13 years. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_free
I’m a teacher (yep, reading a teacher blog) who has had between 45-120 babies of her own (middle school aged). Right now, I only have 11, but I guarantee that regardless of their upbringing at home, affectionately called home trainin’, they know how to act as young women and men in public. Regardless of age, it is indeed the parental responsibility.
Don’t have them if you’re not ready to shoulder the heavy yoke! As a teacher, I leave my babies every nite, which is why I can still love them!
5 Taylor // Jan 1, 2008 at 1:55 pm
@Graham I appreciate your point, and agree. For *those* kids with disabilities. I tend to think, however, that is not the case the majority of the time.
In the case of the spoiled brat, it might even be necessary at times to ignore the tantrum, disability or no, but not in public. Just my opinion.
@mandyg Your child is still a bit young, right? I think you suffer more from not going to nice restaurants than he does, and he can learn social skills at places that are appropriate for him, like Mickey D’s, right?
Yes, I also agree w/ you, Ginger. I should have said child free.
@Ginger As a child free family, do you find it completely disgusting the things people will talk about with you? I had a man come up and say to me, “Guess what, T. lost her mucus plug!”
I said, “Are you seriously talking to me about the mucus coming out of your wife’s vagina?”
It’s inappropriate.
6 blah // Jan 2, 2008 at 4:53 am
my mom had a simple phrase that dealt with this “do you want to go to the bathroom?” amazingly i was very good after because i knew the spanking (however light it inevitably was), would be far worse than not getting the cereal i wanted. thanks mom!
7 meiliken // Jan 2, 2008 at 5:20 am
Child disabilities like add and hyperness and all those other “fake” dysfunctions didn’t exist 100 years ago. You know why? Because they are fake. If parents actually sit with thier kids and teach them like they’re supposed to, these things would not happen. The only disability and dysfunction is the parent. Truth hurts, stupidity hurts more.
8 Graham Wegner // Jan 2, 2008 at 7:23 am
@meiliken. I’m not talking about ADD or anything fake. Try this. Hey, I agree with Taylor, the vast majority of kids are just being snot-nosed, insolent pains. But you never know - and hey, the parents I’m referring to don’t have things easy. Unless, you’d prefer them to stay home away from the public, in shame like they should….
Graham Wegner’s last blog post..When Letting Go Is The Problem
9 Taylor // Jan 2, 2008 at 3:27 pm
Okay - just to weigh in, here…
I think it’s a bit extreme to say that ADD is fake. It’s popular to say that modern people “have it so easy” because we don’t have to chop firewood or go outside to the outhouse to pee. But, I think humanity has always suffered, and modern suffering takes psychological forms. It’s not at all surprising to me that more psychological conditions are identified and treated in modern life since modern life is so stressful, psychologically speaking, even as it gets easier in other ways.
That said, I don’t believe ADD (or any other “fake” psychological conditions) are an excuse for misbehavior. In fact, it becomes all the more important to teach ADD kids how to manage themselves.
@graham I have had friends with autistic family members, and from the exposure I’ve had to autistic children, I doubt anyone would mistake an autistic child for a spoiled brat. It’s pretty clear that there’s a disability there. Unless not all autistic people are as profoundly autistic as the people I have met.
10 Taylor // Jan 2, 2008 at 3:55 pm
@blah It’s good you realize that it’s something to *thank* her for. Many parents are too afraid of their kids lot liking them. But nobody likes growing up and realizing that those who were in charge of making sure one knew how to function were too busy, or lazy, or ignorant, or afraid, or whatever.
11 jose // Jan 2, 2008 at 10:22 pm
Hate to say it, but the only kids I want right now are the ones I borrow from 8-3. Anything else, I’m alright with.
jose’s last blog post..About My Blog: Just Omissions
12 Anne // Jan 3, 2008 at 9:04 am
My kids say I’m mean, but they also tell me I’m the best mommy in the world (not in the same sentence!) They learn their manners, and that means they get to go out and do fun things, like taking them to plays, musicals, and museums. They are 7 and 11 and it’s taken a *long time* to make sure that I can trust them to act appropriately in those situations. otoh, I don’t take them anywhere I don’t think they are ready for either… You definitely won’t see the 7yo at your fancy restaurant! Pizza joints are about his speed.
13 SagaciousHillbilly // Jan 3, 2008 at 1:32 pm
Agreed. Out of control children are the result of out of control parents.
Most of it is a result of touchy feely ‘ let the children do what they want and then let them suffer the consequences bullshit.’
Mt children didn’t get aways with such behaviors in public for 10 seconds and they knew they wouldn’t. They knew they’d suffer immediate consequences and it wouldn’t be pretty.
They have all grow up to be happy and socially responsible adults who love their parents and respect the way they were raised.
Oh, and growing up, they told me EVERYTHING that was going on in their lives.
Fuck these parents who don’t control their children and feel sorry for their children.
SagaciousHillbilly’s last blog post..New Year’s meanderings
14 nathan // Jan 3, 2008 at 9:34 pm
Okay, so here’s a scenario. Hypothetical only, but close enough to the reality of some folks I know that I’d be curious to know what you think. Let’s say I’m the father of a three-year-old and a newborn. My wife and I both work full-time, otherwise we can’t pay the mortgage. One day after work I pick both of them up from daycare. On the way home we stop at the grocery store. The kids and I are all exhausted. The baby starts fussing, and the older one starts whining, and it escalates until it’s, well, loud. What do you want me to do? Slap them? Not acceptable. Leave the store so you don’t have to hear it? Well, sorry, we need food. Reason with them? Hah. Threaten them? Control them? You try it. The point is, oftentimes what you’re seeing in public is only one tiny facet of a larger issue, namely, a family in which all the members are under stress, feeling overwhelmed, and having a hard time coming up with effective coping strategies. People are not born being good parents. Your comfort or serenity are not at the top of their priority list when they haven’t gotten a decent night’s sleep in eight months. “Boo hoo,” you might say, “I don’t care — you brought this on yourself” — and I suppose you’d be right. But you may (or may not) want to consider that some of the parents you’re castigating probably would like nothing better than to “deal” with the situation, but have no idea how.
15 ken // Jan 3, 2008 at 9:59 pm
intractable little brats populate my every school, my little slice of heaven proving no exception.
Oh, take this little anecdote from today:
A teacher has her student’s draw pictures to demonstrate their understanding of vocabulary.
One word is ‘inter’. So, this one kid draws a tombstone and writes the teacher’s name on the tombstone. He presents his drawing and the entire class laughs. The teacher, calm and direct, states that she really doubts that they would all laugh is she or anyone else died.
This student then goes on to say, ‘hey, remember that kid who blew his head off last year here? yeah, well, I thought that was really funny and I laughed my ass off.’ This kid then makes a gun with his fingers and puts it under his chin and makes ‘pow - pow’ noises. The class laughs.
Are you fuckin’ kidding me??? And I asked my wife tonight, what is the cause of this behavior? Is this parenting? Is this a school system that, in love with social promotion and test scores, lets such deplorable playground behavior evolve into an antipathy for life?
And I look @ my kids and wonder, will my kids turn out to be like those in that classroom today?
ken’s last blog post..parent of the year
16 Damian // Jan 4, 2008 at 11:45 am
@ken Don’t you know you can’t curse on the Internet? Fie and for shame, sir.
Damian’s last blog post..A: Shit.
17 Damian // Jan 4, 2008 at 11:50 am
Well, that was an unintentional little irony right there (or is it meta-irony? or meta-meta-irony?)
Damian’s last blog post..A: Shit.
18 annoyed MAMA // Jan 4, 2008 at 2:07 pm
Thank you @Nathan. And I would like to please take your point a bit farther. I was at the supermarket with my husband and two sons age 4 and 6 on a Monday evening. The boys were very happy to be out after a few days of being couped up after a cold streak and were particularly animated. Not rude, not obnoxious, not whiny or intrusive, just happy, bubbly: “Look mommy SHREK!” “LOOK mommy Bob the BUILDER!” Energetic and full of life as children SHOULD be. You get the picture. I was met with more rolled eyes and annoyed glances than I care to admit as a member of the human race. As we paid for our bill and my husband quickly ushered the children out ahead of me, I noticed something while I was collecting my shopping bags: silence. Utter and complete silence. As I glanced around me to see why, all I could see was a bunch of solemn people self-imprisoned in the confines of their personal space. It was weird. When I go to the supermarket during the day it is a whole different story - I homeschool my kids so they are always with me - I get smiles, Good Mornings, even tips and advice for dealing with energetic little boys, even reminders to let stuff slide with them because “they are only this age once, young lady”. And then it hit me: During the day mostly old people are in the markets and streets. As I looked around I noticed that everyone was in their mid-20’s to early-40’s, fresh off the subway from work. Annoyed, tired… annoyed! No wonder there are no other parents with children here! This is a horrible disgrace in my opinion. We cannot under any circumstance be THIS annoyed with children - especially two little boys who were not bothering anyone, were not being rude or obnoxious, but were just exhibiting the natural human tendency to be amazed and well, damn it, just plain old… happy! And For God’s sake people!! THEY ARE CHILDREN!!!
Climbing on tables while others are having dinner - not good. Desensitization to death, hardship, etc. - not good but a reality. BUT my point to all this is that maybe… just maybe, we have become WAY less tolerant than is acceptable towards others as equally entitled as ourselves, because let’s face it: Just because you are child-free does NOT entitle you to be rude by being annoyed with the existence of other human beings and their acceptable-for-their-age behaviors. And that also applies to a beef I have in regards to the treatment of the elderly, but I’ll leave that for another place. EVERY member of society has a right to be here. And not as an expense - you can’t see it as a burden you can’t do anything about. The existence of the elderly around us teaches us that we need to slow down: they were where we are now and therefore we will soon be where THEY are now - learn something from them. The existence of children around us teaches us that we ALL have a responsibility to the future. And that responsibility also means dealing with the pros and shortcomings of ALL our co-members in society. And I don’t buy any of that “I don’t care — you brought this on yourself” bullshit either because if that’s the way you want to play it, then the children that are sensing disdain for their existence today are the ones that are going to grow up and play BINGO with your Social Security money tomorrow cause YOUR annoying (too slow, sunday driver, nothing to offer, there could be long list)!
Face it: Children are works in progress - just like we ALL are. Not perfect little commanded soldiers to be marched down the supermarket aisle in silent procession in order to not distrub you while you are in your perpetual “annoyed mode”. And who’s not to say that YOU don’t have the obligation to become happy, bubbly, animated shoppers instead? Where does this sense of entitlement come from? And children are children. They are louder than adults, more animated than adults, more honest than adults, more energetic than adults, more excited and excitable than adults, get irratable quicker than adults. And that is reality. And no… I am not advocating impoliteness, selfishness, run-amockness (which in my book is the same as selfish and impolite), or any of the other rude behavior that is just plain unacceptable from anyone. But I cannot stand that when something comes from a child it is automatically more annoying and bothersome than when it comes from anybody else.
Case and point: We are on an 11 hour flight (yes, non-stop) that was also delayed for 6 hours. While the lights in the plane were off my children slept. After the lights came on and with 80 minutes to go till landing, my boys awoke, ate breakfast which had already been served and were playing with there father and laughing. The woman behind me LOUDLY comments to me about my children’s noise level, how she was up all night with her daughter in the hospital before we left and how she is trying to sleep. The guy who was sitting next to her and behind me, who was having a heated discussion with the lady across the aisle from him ALL night, AND had his light on all night next to her, AND did not let ME sleep, did NOT bother her. The fact that all the lights were on, and sunshine was coming through the open windows, and people were talking after they had just had their coffee and breakfast did NOT bother her. MY kids bothered her. My husband ripped her a new one despite my protests (her being in the hospital and all) and in retrospect I am proud of him for doing so.
So I have decided that I pay WAY too much money in taxes to be made to feel that I am a second class citizen for simply deciding to procreate. And if I have to accept the SUPER loud music from passing automobiles when I tell my kids that they should respect other peoples existence around them, the hiked-up mini skirts and flashes of privates I don’t care my sons to see just yet when I tell them they cannot walk around without shirts, stupid cashiers who cannot figure out change in no less than five minutes when I drill my boys daily, solemn funeral-procession child-free thirty-somethings with sour faces when I teach my sons to not take their emotions out on people who have done nothing to them, customer dis-service from people who cannot speak English (most of them NOT foreigners) when i correct my sons’ English at every turn, people who curse profusely when I teach my children not to, people who are rude when I teach my children to be polite, people who cut in front of me in line while I explain to MY children that it is not right and we will be better people and wait, then the world around me is going to get a reality check: children are children and I, at least, will allow mine to be just that.
NOT my intention to offend anyone. I just want to give the other side of the story and put out there that the problem lies on both sides: a little “too much tolerance” on one side, but also a little “not enough tolerance” on the other. OK, and maybe I needed to let it out a bit too… sorry and thank you.
19 annoyed MAMA // Jan 4, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Oh my God… I didn’t realize - the box thingy is so little and deceptive… I am so, SO sorry for the ramble.
20 Taylor // Jan 4, 2008 at 6:17 pm
@annoyed MAMA A few preliminary thoughts. I can’t blog at work, so I’m just now reading this.
First, thank you for your comments. I really do appreciate your taking time to comment.
I may not have made myself clear: I am *not* talking about kids “being kids.” In fact, I really do enjoy kids when they’re being curious, expansive, joyful, as you described. You specifically mentioned that your boys were *not* being obnoxious. This is completely different than, for example, a kid who is literally SCREAMING so loud at the dollar store that he can be heard ALL over the store, as I have seen before. This mother, rather than taking the kid outside and handling the situation, sat in the line and let him scream. It was deafening. (When this mother left the store, the child held on bodily to the metal detector and she just pulled him, bodily, until he was parallel to the floor, screaming, red-faced, veins popping out of his neck.)
I assume from your comment (and the site you found my blog from) that you live in New York City. I’ve never been to New York City myself, and hate to harbor a stereotype, so correct me if I’m wrong, but New Yorkers are known for being fast, busy, in a hurry, and “intolerant” as you describe. I think, though, that this “prison of personal space” might be a reaction from living in a very crowded city, kind of like being in an elevator.
So, it seems to me that you are annoyed by some experiences you have had, just like I am. And yes, everyone does have the right to exist. No argument there.
The parts of your comment that I do take issue with are these:
Your comment I already mentioned…. “all I could see was a bunch of solemn people self-imprisoned in the confines of their personal space.” This, to me, sounded quite belittling.
And it brings me to the next point, and the main one, that I have, which is this:
I truly do not see how you can say that parents are treated as second class citizens. Period.
Parenthood, in my experience, is all-excusing in many arenas of life. I have been told by employers that, even though I do a better job than some other women in the office, I am paid less because I don’t have children. I pay more in taxes than those with children. Some parents expect the whole world to behave differently because of the presence of children. And if I wanted to start an apartment building for single or child-free people, it would be illegal.
People think it is completely acceptable in social situations to question my decision not to have children, and ask my why I don’t like children. This is crazy.
I don’t have children because I loved my potential/unborn children too much to bring them into the world before I was ready. This is not, as is commonly said, because I am selfish. There were many years of my life when I would have personally been enormously gratified to have children. But it wouldn’t have been good for them. (Bad marriage, for example.)
So, I agree that there is fault on both sides. But it doesn’t sound like your children are among those I’m talking about here.
Also, planes are just rough on everybody. I once sat next to a man on a cross-country flight who opened a can of sardines. Disgusting. Smelly. No ventilation.
It sounds like you try to teach your children the things they should know, and that’s all I’m asking. But I love this conversation because frankly I’m tired of the “what’s wrong with you that you don’t want children” looks I get.
21 Taylor // Jan 4, 2008 at 6:31 pm
Also, regarding the plane: If there were kids being loud and bothering me on a plane, I would probably *feel* annoyed too. Planes are just miserable in general. But I would know I was *wrong* for that, and would try to be polite anyway.
So, I’m not saying that some politeness and restraint aren’t called for on our side.
Also, again, I can’t even begin to count the times I have been asked to take on extra work because someone at work had to leave to do this or that for her children.
22 Taylor // Jan 4, 2008 at 6:31 pm
Feeling annoyed isn’t a crime. Being rude is.
23 The Beautiful Kind // Jan 5, 2008 at 12:13 pm
I have a 7 yr old daughter with ADHD. I am glad I only have one kid, because that is already more than I can handle.
Before I bred, I thought I was going to be the super parent - the one who would breastfeed her kid until she was two, would make her baby food, teach her to read when she was three, and get her playing the piano and violin in concerts by the time she was 6. Yeah right. About the only thing I accomplished on that list was breastfeeding her until she was 1.
Speaking just for myself, I am extremely considerate of other people when I’m out in public. I don’t get popcorn when I watch a movie because I don’t want my chewing to annoy others. I clean up after myself in retail stores. I tidy up my plates and group them together when I dine out so the server doesn’t have to lean across the table as much. When I leave a hotel I place all my towels in the sink so the person cleaning the room doesn’t need to bend over as much because I know he or she (yeah RIGHT, SHE) has to clean 10 rooms in a row and if each hotel guest helped out a little her job would be a lot easier.
But hey, kids WEAR YOU DOWN. It’s impossible to be the perfect parent all the time, so you have to cut yourself some slack. Unfortunately that sometimes happens in public, too. You have to choose your battles, decide if something warrants the energy necessary to reign in a tornado.
For instance when my kid would crawl around on a restaurant floor, I knew that if I sat her back up in the chair she would be back down on the floor five more times in the span of five minutes, so was it worth it to make a fuss about it? If we were in a corner and not in other people’s way, I would let it slide, but if we were sitting close to people and I felt like she was encroaching on their territory, I would go through the motions to civilize her.
I don’t really like other kids and see parents doing a bad job ALL THE TIME. But nobody is perfect, and let’s hope everyone does the best they can, or maybe a little better.
It should go without saying that I love her more than anything, but I feel the need to say it anyway since I spoke so honestly here.
And I wish I could go back and proofread this and fine tune it, but the daughter is standing here breathing down my neck for a turn on the computer to play Webkinz and I need to shower my day-old self.
Thanks for this thoughtful post!
The Beautiful Kind’s last blog post..Even MORE Shit Talk
24 annoyed MAMA // Jan 5, 2008 at 12:18 pm
Yes, much to my shame for allowing my emotions to run petty, it was a belittling statement. I just feel very frustrated - a group of teenagers can frequent my favorite cafe and be rowdy and noisy (personally I love the liveliness) and that is OK with the other patrons, but one exclamation about the to-die-for chocolate/pecan/caramel cake from my son and I get side-glanced. I just do not like the double standard - same with airplane lady - everyone was up and about but the children had to be quiet?? But you’re right, there is no excuse for rudeness, and I am sorry.
And yes, I agree with you on plenty. It is not right that you get paid less when your work is as good if not better. Isn’t the unit of measure supposed to be, that for which you are going to actually get paid - your work??? I also know that when I started interviewing (seems like eons ago) I was specifically advised not to hint at being in a relationship, and even though it is not legal to ask me if I was planning to get pregnant, to offer up the information that I was far from starting a family so as not to be passed up for a position (I guess for all the reasons you mentioned.)
As for starting and apartment complex for child-free people… I just have to say that that is one of the best ideas I have ever heard! It might be illegal but so is denying my family an apartment *because* I had 2 children but that did not stop anybody for the 2 and a half (yes, you heard me right) years that I was desperately trying to find an upgrade to our expanding family (and mind you, no one was discreet about it). People with children have different needs as well as different tolerances for noise
than child-free people do and I cannot believe someone didn’t already do this.
Taxes and picking up parent-slack… what do I say… I mean I can go into how the parents of today are raising the pillars of tomorrow’s society. I can say that we are the ones raising the people who will have to care for all of us in our feeble, delicate, golden years. And even if only some of us are raising children, *all* of us will need these people tomorrow - for them to become lawmakers, doctors, garbage collectors, firefighters, volunteers, advocates, etc. so we can really use that little tax break. Or that little help at work. But whatever I say, the fact still remains, understandably, annoying. My opinion on the matter is - and not trying to step on any toes here - just as my father who didn’t speak any English never thought of applying for a job answering phones, or my mother who, as she got older, could not lift heavy objects had to pass on a job at a laundromat, people who cannot fulfill the obligations of a job description should really not be applying for them. I am aware that I cannot successfully fulfill my obligations of my prior career as software developer (very demanding hours in some sectors). I should not choose that as an option when I decide to re-enter the workforce. But if the moment arises that I will have to leave my offspring to be raised by someone else it will be for financial reasons and those jobs pay fairly well. Do you see the dilemma here? I think that is how it happens - although I do feel apologetic about it and for what it’s worth you are right - and those of us who depend on others in the workforce to pick up our “slack” should feel humble, apologetic and thankful, not entitled.
Rudeness is not acceptable - by any stretch of anyone’s imagination. (And if you think it’s hard waiting in line with a screaming child, try explaining to a six year old why he cannot cut in line at the park when most of the other kids are doing it). And a sense of entitlement is, as well, rude. We parents should not feel that way, and no, no one else should either.
As far as you not having children and being pestered about it (quite rudely I might add) please forgive my intrusion, but I must say to you what I told a very good friend of mine who told me the exact same thing. It is people like you who SHOULD have children. I know it sounds weird and you are probably thinking “OK, the woman MUST be dumb - I’m throwing in the towel.” But hear me out for a second. You are exactly the type of person that would raise children the way they should be raised: being aware of the fact that you are not ready means that you have full concept of the actual responsibility and what it entails. You will not enter into this obligation lightly, frivolously. And THAT is a parent (when said potential parent is ready). I am not trying to sway you so please don’t get upset at me – I was just offering up some food for thought, maybe also to other people contemplating parenthood. Just as I said to a gay couple who were friends of mine, after they looked at me inquisitively when I commented on their childless relationship: “Nice people should ALWAYS have children.” But I offer that up as a thought – NOT an argument point. Maybe it is just that so many people do NOT think about their responsibilities (emotionally and financially) before they start “popping them out” that it happens to be a prominent thought in my head. And the exact same argument for you having children PROVES that your decision not to have children is responsible, mature – not selfish – I don’t understand how people cannot see that.
25 annoyed MAMA // Jan 5, 2008 at 12:19 pm
For some reason I cannot just respond with a sentence or two… I home school the boys and am home all day with them - I believe I am starved for some adult conversation (ya think?) lol. So I apologize for the length and will try to control myself in the future. And Taylor, I thank you for the opportunity. Even though we ended up sort of agreeing on everything and I have not offered up much of a debate, it was a pleasure “talking” to you and am very grateful.
26 Jessica // Jan 5, 2008 at 12:27 pm
What I LOVE is being told by strangers what a wonderfuly behaved child I have.
Well it was not always that way. My son got kicked out of 3 preschools as a youngster. He simply did not mind his teachers or us. He was out of control.
It was then that I knew something had to be done, and discovered 1 2 3 Magic. I use it consistantly, and it’s saved my life as well as his.1-2-3 Magic is amazing. If you use it 99% consistantly…it works! It works of you work it.
We clung to 1 2 3 like we were drowning parents. That’s the only way it works. With consistancy.
www.parentmagic.com
I only wish that every parent received this system upon leaving the hospital with their child. It would save a lot of needless hitting and screaming, and provide their children with the ability to problem solve and make great choices independently.
PS: Here’s what happened when 1 2 3 magic was used at school and home consistantly:
I can’t say that 1 2 3 Magic did all that for him..he’s very bright. It simply game HIM the tools to make GOOD choices. And isn’t that what we really want…our kids to grow up learning how to make good choices for themselves?
He is now in a prestegious private school in our area, was promoted to the first grade accademic program and he’s only 5
27 Taylor // Jan 5, 2008 at 12:55 pm
@Jessica That is amazing. I think parenting is so hard, but you just have to keep trying and eventually it’ll pay off. (Spoken like a non-parent, right?)
Now that you mention it — I wish schools taught more life skills like parenting (and financial management, and nutrition, and health, and making good choices in general.)
It couldn’t hurt to give young people tools for managing life, could it?
Thanks so much for contributing to the conversation!
28 Taylor // Jan 5, 2008 at 1:03 pm
@annoyed MAMA
I too, love the conversation, and all your points are excellent. Maybe *you* should start a blog! But feel free to comment as much as you like! That’s what it’s for!
I would be the same way if I were home all day with kids, especially since I’m used to being in a classroom w/ 150 people all day!
You’re not the first to tell me about having kids, and I take no offense. I’m not ruling it totally out, but I’m already 36, so I don’t know how old is too old….
Plus, we’d really rather adopt since there are many kids who need homes (and there’s nothing particularly special about *our* DNA) but I think it’s expensive, right?
But, you’re one of the good ones. Thank you for teaching your children well. Plus, other people’s annoyances, so long as they’re not being outwardly rude, really are their problem, you know, so long as you’re doing the best you can, as it seems you are. They’re probably just stressed, just like you & me.
29 Susann // Jan 16, 2008 at 11:15 am
If you can’t control your children — if you’re too “tired” or too “overwhelmed” — then you should never have had them. Period. A GOOD parent is able to teach their children to behave in a manner that, while it may be ebullient/enthusiastic/joyous, is not disruptive/obnoxious/stressful for everyone (including the parent & child).
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